EVE Search - Petition: Remove Slaves from the SCC Markets.

Check My IP Information

All Channels

Intergalactic Summit

Petition: Remove Slaves from the SCC Markets.

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1350	Posted - 2015.03.07 04:52:41 - [1] - Quote Ownership of slaves by commoners and foreigners is a crime against God, and the Civic Court acts in defiance of God by exploiting the SCC's loopholes to line their own pockets by selling slaves to those who have no right to ownership. As has the Kingdom been doing since its inception. Both of these have allowed such despicable acts as the Butcher's blood sacrifices, as well as the blood sacrifices made by other blooder elements infesting the 24IC after the Arzad and Huola victories, which have resulted in the deaths of millions of faithful and which have been condemned by Grand Inquisitor Ohrud Omel of the Ministry of Internal Order. Through acting as an enabler for these evil acts, the Civic Court, the Khanid Kingdom, and the SCC all make themselves equally culpable in the crimes committed and so deserve to have God's justice brought upon them. Not only do they enable evil to be done against God's people, but in their rejection of Scriptural law and exploitation of foreign trading do they spit upon our holy traditions. Through this act do they marginalize the divine rights of Holders as the sole individuals allowed ownership. The worlds of the Heavens are to be ruled by the Amarr, and by the sale of slaves to foreigners do the Civic Court and Khanid Kingdom reject God's mandate and demonstrate that they have no respect for God's Chosen. It is heresy and the sin of greed. It blasphemes against Amarr's traditions and against God, and it allows for great evil to be carried out upon the faithful. It must be ended and its conspirers punished. Signed.
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1357	Posted - 2015.03.07 20:03:33 - [2] - Quote There isn't any need to argue with Mr. Farsaidh. He's stated his opinion and that is enough that needs to be said on either side. If he does not wish to sign the petition then he does not have to. Thank you to everyone that has voiced your support.
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1360	Posted - 2015.03.08 11:27:20 - [3] - Quote It should be noted that this proposal is a call to end the sale of slaves to those who have no divine right to own them. It is not a call to end slavery. If you are signing, what you are advocating for is an end to the liberal business practices that have resulted in the sale of slaves through SCC loopholes to non-Holders. I will ask once again that people please refrain from trying to make this a call for abolition of slavery, because that will only ensure that this measure fails to convince the people it is hoping to convince. This proposal is a call to preserve Amarrian traditions against the evils that have resulted of a foreign-introduced liberal free market. Slaves belong to Amarrian Holders and no others.
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1362	Posted - 2015.03.08 12:02:18 - [4] - Quote Her Imperial Majesty has only said that the time for chains is ending, but that day is not today. It will happen in a manner and time of God's choosing. Until that time we must work to preserve slavery according to proper tradition and Scripture, and resist attempts to turn it into a secular profiteering venture. Thank you again to those that have supported this.
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1366	Posted - 2015.03.08 15:06:29 - [5] - Quote The Butcher is not a legal slave owner in Amarr, regardless of what practices the Kingdom deals in.
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1369	Posted - 2015.03.08 23:12:32 - [6] - Quote Blue spy wrote: What this petition will do is codify into law the divine right for Amarrian holders, and only Amarrian holders to engage in the practice of buying and selling slaves. No, it is not codifying a divine right, because that divine right already exists as law in Scripture. It is encouraging the enforcement of that law in SCC transactions. That law is already enforced in local Amarrian economic policies and has been for thousands of years. Holders are and have always been the sole legal owners of slaves in Amarr. We cannot allow foreign free markets to break down our traditions, especially with the kind of heretical consequences that have arisen from that erosion. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1370	Posted - 2015.03.08 23:30:40 - [7] - Quote Merdaneth wrote: If I wanted to change Imperial and Khanid institutions, I would do it in the form of a petition. Petitions reek of Gallente culture: a culture of self-entitlement. With all due respect, milord... While I understand that there was much chaos in the early years of this decade that were of much graver concern than this, it is something that needs to be changed. I do not normally approve of this kind of petition, but if getting on our hands and knees and begging en masse is the only way to see this evil ended then it would be irresponsible of us to not do it. I will take whatever punishment is due to me for overstepping my place if it would see this horrid practice changed. If you know of a better way to go about this, then please tell me and I will do it. As a commoner I have little other power than my pleas, and can only beg my betters to take these matters to our heirs on my behalf. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1370	Posted - 2015.03.08 23:34:59 - [8] - Quote Blue spy wrote: I was not aware that divine law factored into the day-to-day operations of the SCC. It should factor into all dealings by and with faithful citizens of Amarr, as it has in our economic policies for thousands of years and as was upheld in our previous trading agreements with the other empires. We are not asking the cluster. We are not asking CONCORD or the SCC to change their policies. We are asking our lords to enforce God's law on our people. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1370	Posted - 2015.03.08 23:48:31 - [9] - Quote Thank you, sir. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1375	Posted - 2015.03.09 18:16:56 - [10] - Quote TomHorn wrote: Not signed This petition is useless , pointless, removing slaves from the market will not stop the trade in slaves. Only turn the trade in slaves underground. Making it less regulated and controlled , worsening of conditions for the slaves themselves. These kind of actions are typical of the liberal elite fascists. Liberal? This is as conservative a measure as you can get. Of course, one can't expect a Caldari Provist to know anything about Amarr society. So, here's some information for you: The slave trade in Amarr has been going on for thousands of years in legal planetside markets, between Holders. These are heavily regulated markets, which have very specific Scripture-defined rules about who can and cannot deal in slaves. These markets are not, and have never needed, the SCC. In case you are not aware, the SCC is not the only market that exists in the cluster. It's just an open capsuleer space market. The slave trade in Amarr does not need the SCC to continue, legally, between our Holders. During the liberalization and internationalism of our society in the last century, certain elements of our leadership agreed to participate in an extraplanetary CONCORD-created free market known as the SCC. In this unregulated open market, it was possible for people who have no legal right to slaves to acquire them. In this way, it is in fact the SCC that is an illegal market, by Amarrian laws, because it allows unscrupulous elements in Amarr society to bypass the normal regulations and restrictions of our local policies to sell to a wider base of people who have no legal right to own slaves. This does not turn the trade underground. It returns it to local Amarrian planetside markets, under traditional regulations and policies. That makes it a conservative proposal, not a liberal one. Free market economies, of which the SCC is, is economic liberalism. If you know nothing about politics, don't comment on politics. It's obvious you haven't read anything that was actually posted, because then you would know that this is not an abolitionist proposal and has no intent on stopping the trade. The intent of this, is to move the trade back to local markets, between certified Holders, under the traditions and regulations that have governed the slave trade in Amarr society for thousands of years. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur

Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1377	Posted - 2015.03.09 21:10:08 - [11] - Quote What else can we do, Mr. Vellum? "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1378	Posted - 2015.03.10 15:54:51 - [12] - Quote Pieter Tuulinen wrote: Siddhar Gangari wrote: This petition is without claws. The Ammar will never restrict it's peoples' access to slaves; their frail civilization would slowly avalanche into total collapse. Try developing your reading comprehension. This petition is to cease the sale of slaves on the SCC. It has nothing to do with the Amarr at all - Concord would make the decision and the SCC would enforce it through the simple step.of delisting the commodities in question. No, Pieter, it's not that. It's to get Amarr authorities to make organizations like the Civic Court and Ammatar Consulate remove their standard sell orders from the SCC, and return to conducting their trade of slaves to local planetside markets only. To Mr. Gangari: Restricting sale to just Holders was how we did it for thousands of years. We never collapsed then. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1390	Posted - 2015.03.20 03:00:15 - [13] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: Oh REALLY? You're going to pull the HERETIC card? I love how everyone and their dog loving grandmother seems to have the authority to dictate what IS and what is not HERESY these days! It's as if the Theology Council wasn't necessary anymore, given that they have all of these EAGER VOLUNTEERS! The Empress herself has ordered the destruction of who knows how many slaves (I know because I have relatives in The Order of St. Tetrimon who carried out the attack on Kor-Azor's slaves). Are you now suggesting that our blessed Empress is a HERETIC? Like I said LISTS. YOU. ON ONE. Defense of Empire is far more important and crucial than the re-education of slaves, no matter what Gallentean infiltrators would have anyone believe. It is right to dispense of a 1,000 Reclaimed slaves if it will save but one innocent Amarrian, even the lowest of them. We are at war with the Minmatar Republic and until their aggression ceases, I will view even the most tyrannical slave owner's actions as far less important a crime than the abduction and killing of already-God-fearing CITIZENS. Placing the safety of a slave above the safety of the Empire is EVIL, EVIL, EVIL. Sacrificing yourself for the safety and security of a non-believer slave is worse than anything, you are betraying God's edict to rule, conquer and wreak vengeance on the unholy infidels who turned their backs on their Lord and Master. And you should know that most slaves are stubborn nonbelievers, or you've never worked with the hateful little primitives. The threats to the Empire are many, your ladyship. We must combat all of them, not just one. And this issue has more to do than just the lives of the slaves. It is about upholding our traditions, traditions that have been eroding greatly over the last century. It is about our divine mandate from God. It is about the fact that the sin of greed has caused certain elements in our society to break Scriptural law regarding the rightful ownership of slaves in order to sell to those who are impure. It is a crime against Amarr and against God, and we must combat this threat as surely as we combat threats of the outside. The great Amarr Empire was founded to cultivate the spirit of man. To do so the enemies of the outside had to be defeated and the enemies of the inside controlled. -Book I 1:14 We do not do service to Amarr or God when we ignore one threat to fight another. All enemies of the Empire must be defeated, both those without and those within. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1394	Posted - 2015.03.20 19:27:26 - [14] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: Miss Kernher, please just call me Sayuri. I get what you are saying, but don't you see that is exactly my point? All Amarrian capsuleers seem to like to do these days is fret about paltry issues, or this one politically charged issue, while the big issues that actually threaten Empire space or our values go completely ignored. Ignored? We have not ignored the threats. I have fought heretics, Matari forces, and other threats against the Empire, and my alliance has been doing so for over ten years, recognized for our efforts by His Royal Highness the Heir Ardishapur, Grand Admiral Sundarra, Grand Inquisitor Omel, and others. We have most certainly not been ignoring these issues. The fact that this thread exists is because we are choosing to not ignore this one. Not all threats are as obvious as bullets, ma'am. Many are far more insidious. Open markets forced on us by foreign interests that bypass our religious obligations and regulations are such a threat. Quote: One maniac killing Minmatar slaves is not a threat to the Empire. The Gallente and Minmatar empires both hate us already - there is no repair or redemption of friendship there waiting to be had. They will annihilate us completely if they had the chance. This measure has nothing to do with the Gallente and Minmatar nations. Their opinions are irrelevent. What this is about is protecting our traditions and upholding God's commands as given to us in Scripture. Only Holders have divine right to own slaves. The sale to anyone that is not a Holder is a crime against God. Allowing Scriptural law to be violated, allowing crimes against God to go unpunished, that is a threat. Quote: As long as the faithful stand strong in God's light and God's will, we'll never fail. Placing slaves above the worth of Amarrians is the beginning of an end to the covenant we share with our Lord, our promise to engage in Holy War and wreak his Vengeance on those unfaithful to their Lord, Father and Master. With respect, you are widely misreading this if you believe that it is about 'placing slaves above the worth of Amarr'. The ones who are placing the impure above Amarr are those elements in our society who view the divine rights of Holders as immaterial. The ones who are placing the impure above Amarr are those who believe that God's mandate that the worlds of the Heavens are for the Amarr does not have to be followed. The ones who are placing the impure above Amarr are those elements who feel it appropriate to sell slaves to commoners and godless foreigners. The sale of slaves to foreigners goes against the Reclaiming. It is an Unclaiming. It is an Abandonment of religious responsibilities and divine rights. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1409	Posted - 2015.03.25 13:54:53 - [15] - Quote Dailar Toralen wrote: Also, consider that there are many Capsuleers who fight for the Empire who make a living off of the Slave Trade, and also threw Slave Labor among our ships. If those capsuleers are not Holders, then they have no right to own slaves. And if they are Holders, then they can trade or purchase slaves directly between themselves or at traditional planetside slave markets as they have been doing for thousands of years. Amarr has not needed, and does not need, foreign-controlled markets like the SCC involved in our slave trade. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1409	Posted - 2015.03.25 14:27:14 - [16] - Quote Dailar Toralen wrote: Samira Kernher wrote: Dailar Toralen wrote: Also, consider that there are many Capsuleers who fight for the Empire who make a living off of the Slave Trade, and also threw Slave Labor among our ships. If those capsuleers are not Holders, then they have no right to own slaves. And if they are Holders, then they can trade or purchase slaves directly between themselves or at planetside slave markets. Amarr has not needed, and does not need, foreign-controlled markets like the SCC involved in our slave trade. I never spoke of the SCC, but I did speak of the Slave Trade. We do have right to hold slaves. We are primary suppliers of slaves due to our pillaging and raiding (for some of us). This petition is explicitly about the SCC. And no, you do not have any right. The military has the right to enslave prisoners of war, not the militia. The militia are independent hired combatants. You do not suddenly have any power in Amarr just because you signed a contract to kill people for pay. Even if the militia did have the right to enslave, the right to enslave is much different from the right to own. Scriptural law is very clear on this: Only Holders may own slaves, period. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1409	Posted - 2015.03.25 15:14:27 - [17] - Quote Dailar Toralen wrote: Are you Amarr always going to stand behind your religion as a shield for everything thing you do? Scriptural law is the only law that matters. If you are not serving God then you are not serving Amarr, regardless of your declared loyalties. Quote: Threw joining the Militia Toralen Industries has technically become a part of the Amarrian Empire, along with the rest of the militia. We are not paid in ISK, but in rewards for our loyalty. May I remind you that the Militia is known as the 24th Imperial Crusade, a recognized and large part of the Ministry of War? Your corporation is a privateer organization, granted bounties for combat action against enemies of the Empire by the 24th Imperial Crusade. The fact that the bounty comes in the form of assets instead of isk is irrelevent. We are all independent paramilitary contracters. You are not a member of the Amarr Navy, you are not a professional military officer. If you were a professional military officer, you would be held to exacting restrictions and regulations and would not be permitted to join or leave on a whim. You would only be provided equipment as needed to do your duty, not given it as prize money. Considering how many blood raiders and godless foreigners have infested the 24IC to exploit it for their own benefit, Amarr would be much better off without the militia. The Amarr Navy should be the ones prosecuting the war. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1409	Posted - 2015.03.25 15:56:02 - [18] - Quote Dailar Toralen wrote: And where would your Empire be without us, hm? You would have lost the war already, and destroyed without the State. It is better to lose with grace than to win without. God will look upon those whose victory was carried by the lies of the Deceiver, and He will find them wanting. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1442	Posted - 2015.05.01 17:23:38 - [19] - Quote You are a Gallente capsuleer. You are not a Holder. You have no right to own slaves. The fact that someone like you is able to acquire them is exactly why this measure exists. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1446	Posted - 2015.05.01 19:03:03 - [20] - Quote Sinjin Mokk wrote: Samira Kernher wrote: You are a Gallente capsuleer. You are not a Holder. You have no right to own slaves. The fact that someone like you is able to acquire them is exactly why this measure exists. Point of Order Miss Kernher. If you want to limit the sale of slaves within Amarr, that's fine. Khanid has different laws. Everywhere else has different laws. Some oppose the sale, some do not. Others simply don't care. Be he Gallente or Theran, I'm fairly certain the Empire is in no position to dictate to him what his "rights" are. Now if Mssr. Archipelago is in the market, I have a fine assortment at the moment at popular prices... God is in the position to dictate that right, and He has dictated through Scripture that that right is given exclusively to Holders. It is heresy and a crime against God for anyone that is not a Holder to own slaves. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur

Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1447	Posted - 2015.05.02 01:08:37 - [21] - Quote Sibyyl wrote: It is better for slaves to be listed. How else would other free people buy them and free them? Not listing them on the market would not change the market demand for them one bit. Not listing them would take away access from liberators who would be barred from participating in an underground slave black market. This is another reason why they shouldn't be listed. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1451	Posted - 2015.05.02 17:08:42 - [22] - Quote Group B in such an instance are heretics and should be punished for their transgressions. The fact that criminals like yourself exist and will break laws is not a reason to remove laws. Laws must be made and enforced, and those who break them must be punished. The Khanid model rejects God. It rejects the divine right of Holders by allowing those of impure blood to deal in slaves. It is a faithless model that should never be allowed to translate to Amarr. Only Holder families are of proven purity, wisdom, and responsibility to be entrusted with the ownership of slaves. This is as God has decreed through Scripture. Slavery as an institution only works in the Empire, under the traditional laws that have governed it for thousands of years. Any other group that practices it is immoral and corrupt. And there are non-Minmatar slaves in the Empire, too, Mokk. The Kingdom is not unique in that. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1454	Posted - 2015.05.02 19:33:37 - [23] - Quote Your lordship Ibrahim, This is not something secret or hidden. It is a public sell order produced by the Civic Court (and as well by the Ammatar Consulate). Note in that image that I, a commoner, was able to purchase a slave from Civic Court through that buy order with no strings attached. Additionally, this is not an accusation of criminal activity. Currently, these sales are entirely legal, due to SCC policies. This was stated in the past by Grand Inquisitor Ohrud Omel. It is the call of this measure that Amarr take a stand against the SCC's policies, as these policies act against Scriptural law and the divine right of Holders. While it is not a crime against current liberal international trading laws, it is a crime against God. This is something that should not be legal, and the request we are making here is for Amarr to enforce traditional Scriptural laws and traditions over faithless SCC policies. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1455	Posted - 2015.05.02 23:52:16 - [24] - Quote I am not making an interpretation, my lord. I am stating a fact. The Scriptures make very clear that only Holders may own slaves. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1455	Posted - 2015.05.03 00:15:39 - [25] - Quote What you say above is why I have said that it is a loophole. It is an indecent attempt at exploiting foreign markets to bypass religious laws. It is the effort of certain liberal houses and organizations that put wealth over piety and see the Scriptures not as something to be obeyed as strict doctrine but instead to be evaded and deceived in whatever way makes them the most profit. This has left Holder rights eroded, our slave markets depleting, and countless slaves butchered by heretics or stolen by liberators. All so that a few people can line their pockets. The Empire serves God, not our wallets. These policies must be changed. Amarr laws must be built on Scripture, not foreign kredit. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1460	Posted - 2015.05.03 12:43:46 - [26] - Quote Sinjin Mokk wrote: So how is it that the "group B model" in Khanid is not only allowed to exist, but was ratified by a treaty signed by the Empire and King Khanid II? Are you saying that the Empire went against Scripture? The Empire does not intervene in other sovereign nations' internal affairs under current international treaties. The Kingdom is not part of the Empire, we are just allied. If the Kingdom did proper rejoin the Empire again, then its heresies would be purged. Quote: While the religious leaders in the Kingdom still espouse the concept of slavery as a form of putative enlightenment, many consider this little more than lip service. The Kingdom does not have religious leaders. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1461	Posted - 2015.05.03 21:05:02 - [27] - Quote How dare you accuse this of being a facade. What undesirable results could possibly arise from going back to the trade restrictions that we maintained without issue before the SCC was spawned? What was wrong with the original trading laws, like the Gallente-Amarr Free Trade Agreement? Under those policies, trade goods were strictly controlled and only Holders and licensed representatives were allowed to engage in business with foreign traders. Those policies preserved our cultural values, they upheld our religious principles. The liberal economics of the last few decades have ruined all of that. Maybe Amarr is making more money as a result, but it is the Deceiver's money. Forgive me for actually caring about our traditions. Forgive me for asking that Scriptural laws be held above secular foreign ones. Forgive me for actually caring about what happens to the people I came from. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1473	Posted - 2015.05.06 21:02:18 - [28] - Quote Max Singularity wrote: Congratulations on this message making an official The Scope banner feed!! May they all be free. May we all be free. This measure is not about abolition. It is only about upholding traditional restrictions on who is permitted to own slaves: Holders and Holders alone. If you are looking to end slavery, then this is not the place for it. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1485	Posted - 2015.05.08 07:17:23 - [29] - Quote Jvpiter wrote: Explain to me again what this petition is about, then. To keep them away from people like you. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1490	Posted - 2015.05.08 17:55:44 - [30] - Quote Lulu Lunette wrote: Signed. Free my Vherokior and Minmatar brothers and sisters!! Samira Kernher wrote: This measure is not about abolition. It is only about upholding traditional restrictions on who is permitted to own slaves: Holders and Holders alone. If you are looking to end slavery, then this is not the place for it. "Embrace those who would learn, defeat those who would make mockery of God's way. Through the penance of deeds, the sins of forefathers may eventually be washed away." -- His Royal Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur

Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2187	Posted - 2015.08.14 20:54:17 - [31] - Quote What is binding is Scripture, and Scripture defines that only Holders have spiritual authority to own slaves. And Amarr does hold the monopoly. No other nation has any right to engage in the practice. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2189	Posted - 2015.08.15 00:49:15 - [32] - Quote Lord Mokk, In the interests of diplomacy, I shall offer only the following in response to your comments: I disagree. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2196	Posted - 2015.08.15 08:22:18 - [33] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: No one should pick and choose priorities based on pet vanities, clearly everyone who is so obsessed with abolishing one of our most time-honored traditions loves the delicious feeling of superiority when they denounce slavers. This sort of false morality is governed by self-righteousness instead of the righteousness of God. This petition has absolutely nothing to do with abolition. It is about restoring our traditional values, by eliminating the liberal business practices that have allowed non-Holders to own slaves. Scripture clearly defines the divine rights of Holders, among which is the sole ownership of slaves. This is a tradition that must be reclaimed. Commoners and foreigners have no right to own slaves. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2196	Posted - 2015.08.15 08:38:44 - [34] - Quote Because this isn't about those markets. This is about our markets. About people who are governed under Scriptural law who refuse to uphold it. The Civic Court and the Ammatar Consulate, both who freely and willingly engage in the sale of slaves to commoners and foreigners in defiance of Scripture and traditional laws. Both who try to cite international law to validate their liberal business practices when the laws they should be concerning themselves with is God's Law. The fact that someone like myself, a commoner of minmatar descent and former slave, the absolute furthest thing from being a Holder, can go to a Civic Court station in Amarr space and freely purchase slaves from an Imperial institution, is utterly despicable. That is what this is about. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2196	Posted - 2015.08.15 09:48:04 - [35] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: But you're not going to the Civic Court station and buying slaves. That's your choice. People may choose to sin all the time, that doesn't mean we should analyze ever transaction that happens. But we should. You promote slavery while in the same words oppose it. You say that people should be allowed the freedom to choose to sin or not, while supporting an institution for which the purpose is to shackle people and prevent them from engaging in sinful behavior. Few people can be trusted to uphold righteous behavior on their own will. Restrictions and laws must be enforced to prevent people from allowing themselves to fall to temptation and sin. God demands that His Will be obeyed, and it is our duty as His servants to enforce His Will on those who would refuse Him. Quote: I can't be bothered to go pick up slaves my mother assigns me, and I wouldn't appreciate having to personally travel to the middle of nowhere, interrupting my work in the war machine to have to somehow micromanage slave transactions. But you wouldn't have to. Custodians and slavers given license to act as an official representative of their Holder's will is not in opposition of God. What is in opposition is people void of any such official capacity or even Amarrian nationality being permitted to make slave transactions. That is what must be stopped. Quote: This is just going to restrict progress, business, technological advancement Then let it. Upholding righteous behavior and spiritual prudence is more important than material wealth. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2196	Posted - 2015.08.15 09:50:52 - [36] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: Thornir wrote: Signed. The right to slaves are only to be held by Holders. That's not what the "petition" is about. Actually it's not even a well written petition it's just a paragraph from a liberal fruit dictating to Holders how they should conduct business in Amarr. If every slave in the markets had a Holder standing right next to them they still wouldn't be happy. You're the one promoting liberal economic interests over enforcement of traditional values. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2200	Posted - 2015.08.15 13:17:38 - [37] - Quote As someone who actually fights in the war, I'd appreciate you not telling me what does or does not hurt the war effort. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2201	Posted - 2015.08.15 15:20:20 - [38] - Quote Sinjin Mokk wrote: Ms. Vailatti's quote is older, but it is authentic. You may say it's wrong if you like but I'm not going to suggest a Grand Inquisitor does not know what he's talking about in an open forum. Until the Order or the Council redacts and clarifies the issue further I'm going to work under the assumption that they know what they're talking about. I haven't said that the honorable grand inquisitor's statement is wrong. What I have said is the fact that things are as he has said goes against the divine rights of Holders as written in Scripture, and that this should be rectified. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2208	Posted - 2015.08.15 18:37:49 - [39] - Quote I will repeat, this is not an interpretation of Scripture. Scripture very clearly defines the rights of Holders, which includes the sole ownership of slaves. I obey Amarr. I obey God. Amarr's law, and God's law, is dictated in Scripture, and Scripture comes before all other things. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2219	Posted - 2015.08.16 04:09:38 - [40] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: I think many more economically minded people above me realize it would be a bureaucratic disaster and stifle progress. So, more of the liberal cancer that plagues Amarr. God does not care how fat one's wallet is. One cannot buy their way into Heaven. "Remember where you came from. Be you a freed slave, a descendant of slaves, a merchant, a Navy officer, a Holder, or even royalty, it is paramount to remember the roots of the faith. All men are created to serve God and do His will. It is not merely time served that shall be rewarded, but the conviction and faith with which you serve." - His Highness the Heir Yonis Ardishapur "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council

Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2220	Posted - 2015.08.16 06:26:22 - [41] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: anti-slavery We are not anti-slavery. What we are opposed to are the liberal business practices and free market economies that you promote. We who are fighting for this are in favor of regulation, restoration of traditional values, and upholding of Scriptural law. We are pro-slavery. Quote: I am grateful that I attend a church where slave whipping techniques are still taught to youngsters at religious lessons and mortification of the flesh is considered to be holy still. I have been whipped and beaten for when I have failed to uphold my obligations. I have scars both overseer- and self-inflicted to prove my faith and punish my transgressions. I am grateful to have been born in a place where Scriptural law is upheld above all other things. I am blessed to have been born in His Highness the Heir Ardishapur's demesne, where I could be brought up in accordance with God's will. I am very grateful that I was not raised in a place where material interests are placed above spiritual pursuits. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2220	Posted - 2015.08.16 06:36:20 - [42] - Quote The Leopardess wrote: I mean, how do you think taking slaves OUT of the Amarr Empire protects them? These are matters of sin. It is much worse for a slave to be rescued and sent to battle against us than it is for a Blood Raider to slay them, for then at least they are a martyr to the Lord, innocent of blame. You do realize that the SCC's practices are what allows slaves to be taken out of Amarr and sent to battle against us? Every slave that is purchased by a foreigner is a slave that is taken out of Amarr and into the hands of those who have no right to hold them and no fealty to Amarr or God. "The word of the Empress is the word of God, the will of the Empress is the will of God. Let no man seek to shirk his obligations before God and His chosen representative in this world." -- Datna Jesebel, Principal Clerk of the Theology Council
Samira Kernher Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 2252	Posted - 2015.08.23 12:03:58 - [43] - Quote Please take this argument somewhere else. Yonis Ardishapur for Emperor "Reclaim our Empire"

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.